Topic : 11/24 Great School Debate

There's a lot of misconceptions about homeschooling put out by people who have only heard stuff from a friend who knows a friend who maybe tried it.  A lot of it really depends on the parent - how much they're willing to commit to providing a rounded experience for their kid.  If you have an idea that all you have to do is feed them lessons, the kids will suffer. I and my brother were homeschooled up until college, and my mom made sure we did a lot more than sit with a textbook for a few hours each day. I learned to read when I was 3...upside down. I liked hanging off the back of the couch, and since it didn't affect my learning in the slightest, mom didn't make a big deal about it. I read the entire Little House series when I was five. School would not have been as forgiving in my teaching.
Mom encouraged us to explore things that interested us - go to the library and check books out on it, get into it. My brother and I spent hours playing inside or outside together, time we would have spent chained to a chair in a classroom, and even now I still have a good relationship with him, because of that time. And we never had a babysitter. Mom took us everywhere with her - to the grocery store, to the bank, to the post office, to the mall. Because of that, we developed the ability to converse and be comfortable with people much older than ourselves, something I don't think we would have gotten if we'd gone to public school. And we learned young to respect that a lot goes on in keeping up a house!
When I was 15, I got bored since there wasn't much left that mom could teach me, so I passed the ASSET entry test and used the Running Start program to start at the nearby community college. Mom was still there for me through the whole process, and I graduated in two years with more credits than I actually needed and an Associate in Arts and Sciences degree. From there I transfered to the university, and at the moment I'm 18, a senior, on the honor roll, working on departmental honors, and ready to graduate next June with a Bachelors in Japanese linguistics. I have a part-time job at the library (still love reading), and this quarter I'm finishing up taking 4 classes, three of them 400-level. My brother just started at the community college when he was 17.
I really don't think my life, or his, has been negatively affected by homeschooling. Obviously.
And it goes to show that you get success stories from both sides. The situation of the parent has a lot to do with it, and some people can't or would rather not devote their entire existance to their kids (I know I couldn't). In that case public school is definitely the better environment. But to say that homeschooled kids are socially maladjusted is ridiculous. Look at the local community centers, or Girl Scouts, or Camp Fire, or Boy Scouts - there's activities for kids all over the place that will let them interact with a peer group at their own age level if that's what they want, without needing school. However, saying that you HAVE to be with people the same age as you is only teaching you to interact with people the same age as you - many of whom will have a negative influence on you if you let them! A wider range of exposure seems like it would prepare kids better for the real world...after all, you're not always going to be in school.
And I don't think I would have had half as good a childhood if I'd gone to school. I have no regrets.

I have read several entries that talk about how homeschooling can be a negative effect to children. I do believe that it can! I also believe that public school as well as private school can have the same effect on the same children. I am a supporter of home schooling for several reasons. First of all, children are easily influenced. This past fall I put my son in private school. The difference between him now and before going to school is amazing. Not in a good way. I feel that in order to shape my children into mature responsible adults, I must be an example. I cant do that if im not there.

 

Secondly, there is a misconception that all teachers have learned and memorized everything that they have ever been taught from preschool up to college and that they are always available to rattle off any fact at a moments notice. That is a myth. Most teachers learn right along with the kids. The things they learn in college to prepare for teaching are methods for getting information across to the children. Not the information its self.  In other words they have a cirriculum that tells them what to teach. Home schooling is no different. The parents have a book that tells them what to teach and explains it in a way that a junior highschooler could teach and be effective. Most parents know what their children need to enjoy learning, more so than a teacher that has never met them beyond the first day of school.

 

Thirdly and lastly, I do not feel that socialization or danger is a good deciding factor in deciding the form of education for your children. I know many home schoolers that grow up to be head CEO's and politicians. I do not believe that public schools create a benifical or negative aspect to a child's social life. As far as the danger that poses a threat to public school, I firmly believe that the danger risk found in a school can be found anywhere from inside your home to inside the grocery store. Those that use that as an excuse simply want to hold tight to their children and not let them go.

 

In all this, I believe that it is up to a parent to shape a child's habits. I commend public schools for teaching those children who's parents cannot teach them themselves. I commend even more the parents who go without so that they can stay home with their children. To those parents I say remember that your child needs the social skills that shape the way they will live their life. Don't just keep them home all the time. It is easy to get them involved. To the public school parents, remember that it is not the schools job to raise your kids. Be involved in your kids life so that you know what is going on on a regular basis. Thanks for reading!

 http://sandradodd.com/interview

if you want a real representation of what unschooling is, read this article by Sandra Dodd.  In fact her whole website is a vast array of info that will shatter anyone's preconceived notions.

I guess I have a unique perspective in this debate, which seems to be often between parents who believe that homeschooling is the 'best' and others who believe school is 'best'.

 

First of all, I find it interesting that Dr. Phil quoted data that indicates that socially, school may be best from middle school on. As a person who suceeded in school academically, but was one of the social outcasts who was shy, teased and picked on mercilessly, I fail to see how those years were good for me! The young lady who is so adamant that she missed out is only looking at the half-empty side of her glass. I never went to prom or high school sporting events, either.

 

In our case, my two oldest children, now adults, went to public school. We live in a moderately large suburb; crime is low here but it's no Mayberry. My oldest son was unhappy from middle school on. We kept him in school, and in retrospect I regret it. He burnt out during high school and did not go to college. My second son got through fine academically, but he picked up some values I wish he had not. Of course, that's life- my values are different from my mom's too! But some, I believe, were a direct result of flaws in our school system. 

 

As for my third child, she too was unhappy with the social behavior in middle school. So we took her out and homeschooled her for two years. Socially and emotionally, it was the best thing I could have done for her. She's now at a magnet high school, and is mature enough to handle the social pros and cons there, without the distress she felt in middle school. We chose to send her back to school because academically, her learning style does better with active classroom discussion, but I would never send another of my children to the regular public high school my boys went to.

 

And then there's my last child. She went to carefully chosen public elementary schools (2) and had carefully chosen teachers. But by middle school, I know from experience that is not easy to do with multiple teachers. She is smart and has many friends, but also shy and has some mild learning disabilities. We've now been homeschooling for just over a year, and her test scores last year were way up from any year she spent in public school. Socially, she doesn't have the bullying and negative examples to deal with. Certainly, though, she has to learn to get along in group situations and with different personalities, as she is enrolled in a variety of enrichment activities and we have a large and active homeschool support group here.

 

To those who would say 'yeah, but at least you tried school, homeschooling may be better for a few kids but the average kid would do better in school', I have to respond that so many of the people I've met through homeschooling have such wonderful kids. They are knowledgeable about many things, socially adept not only with their own age group but with adults and younger children as well. Their academic knowledge may not tie directly to the skills taught at school- they may be way behind learning math but amazing writers, or vice versa. But most parents I know don't take the attitude that the student never has to learn the skill that's behind, only that it isn't required that each child be proficient in multiplication at age 10, but at their own pace. Sure, some are more behind than in my opinion is best, but the 'failure' rate, if it is that, is not as high as in school, where only a percentage of students are really sucessful while others drop out, fail, or feel 'stupid' their entire school years. Everyone who went to school knows which kids I mean.

 

To those who say homeschooled kids miss out on social experiences that make them better able to cope, I say my own social experiences in school left me with scars that took years to recover from, and while many people have happy memories, I am not alone. Many people are successful in the world without the experience of large (1000+ students) schools. My husband runs a successful business in this city; he graduated high school in a small rural community with a graduating class of perhaps 30 students, many of whom were his cousins. His experience was more different from mine than my homeschooled child's is! People succeed as adults with many different educational and personal backgrounds.

 

To professional teachers: I respect you and your skills more than you know. I have had good relationships with so many wonderful teachers, as a child and as a parent. And of course, some that were not so wonderful too. I wouldn't consider teaching a class of 20-30 kids full-time without your educational background. But I'm NOT doing that. All I need to teach is my own child. Maybe there are some things I could do better with your skills, but I think they are more than balanced out by my knowledge of who she is and how she learns- something every teacher must learn about each student every year. I don't have to present information to a big group, keep their attention, control their behavior, cover the material in many different ways so different students understand it. I open a book and my daughter and I read a lesson together, then practice the skills. If she doesn't understand something, I know it immediately and we work it out. If we hit a 'wall', there is a huge support system in the form of other homeschooling parents and teaching resources on the internet. The 'problems' so many people worry about are not insurmountable!

 

There is more than one 'right' way to raise children, and there is also more than one 'right' way to educate them. We shouldn't be having a homeschool 'debate', but a discussion to educate parents on an alternative form of education, and how to decide whether it is right for them- or not.

 

The tests given now  do not test whether a kid is getting an education, ie, the ability to think and learn independently.  They test whether the kid has been trained to take the test and give the "right" answer.  In other words, a test of training (how to read words, compute numbers) is not testing education (the ability to analyze words and thoughts and to reason on one's own).  The superior private schools in my State are exempt from the tests.  These schools will not allow their kids to be held back  by studying to the test.

<<<You can find the same classes in public school without the cost. >>>  That is where you are very sadly mistaken.  A public school cannot teach religion or even talk about it.  The history lessons in private schools are saturated with religion...just like real life is!  There is no way you can say that the teaching of a private religious school is anywhere near equal when it comes to teaching History in the public school!

 

 

all subjects do not have a religious background or origin.  History must include the role of religion, because it has been powerful.  For example, war usually contains threads of religious motivation.  The role of women in society cannot be understood without looking at how major world religions have viewed women.  However, science & math have no religious background, unless you mean how scientists have had to fight religious authority throughout world history.  Remember Galileo, who was to be excommunicated until he confessed he was wrong to say the earth rotated around the sun?  How about the preachers who accused Queen Victoria of mortal sin for using anesthetics during childbirth?  After all, they argued, woman was supposed to bring forth children in pain & suffering, according to the bible.  Foreign language may use words from religion, but it is not about religion.   English grammar?  

 

You are entitled to your beliefs, but not to insert your beliefs into public education.  Besides, who's to define religious background?  The imams in the fanatical islamic schools where jihad is taught?  Amish beliefs about not using modern conveniences such as electricity?  Evangelicals who believe that everyone who isn't "saved" is going to burn in hell no matter if they lived good lives or bad? Orthodox Jews who do not allow a man to touch a grown woman, even to shake hands?  Roman Catholics who think it's better to give birth to children doomed to sickness & starvation rather than use birth control?  Hindus who place people in castes based upon birth & oppress the lower castes?

 

Did you ever wonder why this country is named the UNITED States? 

The thing is, although I've been a homeschooler for 10 years and although I, myself, was homeschoold for a period of time, I'm also a professional educator.  I have one child in a good public school, and two who have never been to school.  For the record, all three are well rounded, athletic, play on sports teams, and are on equal footing with agemates.  I also work with at least 100 homeschooling families a year.

 

I do, however, notice something different about my child who is in school.  He's not nearly as self-motivated as his non-schooled siblings.  He's much more into what others will think about him and pleasing others than his non-schooled siblings.  And he is much more reluctant to do school work than his non-schooled siblings.  He finds learning to be a task one must do before getting on with life.  HIs non-schooled siblings don't necessarily feel that way. 

 

HOwever, I also spend a LOT of time volunteering at his school.  The kids who are doing the best are the ones with the most involved parents.  It's the same with homeschooling.  The families who do it the best are the ones that are most involved and attuned to the needs of their children.  And, basically, those who don't, typically originally HAD kids in school and the families sucked at dealing with brick and mortor schools as well.  And the homeschoolers who are not good at homeschooling are also no better at sending their kids to school.  I see it time and time again.

 

Regardless of the approach to homeschooling, those who do it well will do it well, their kids will be fine, and become productive members of society.  The same is true of those who use brick and mortor schools well, regardless of whether their kids go to private, parochial, or public schools.

 

Many people have preconceived notions of what homeschooling is.  It is indeed the rare homeschooler who is not out in the world and socializing with others.  For instance, my one child has a job (and is the only homeschooler there), plays on an elite soccer team (and is the only homeschooler there), does community service (where there is a much larger representation of homeschoolers than schoolers---wonder why?), has both strengths and weaknesses in academics, and has many diverse friends.  He has some homeschooled friends who are not as well rounded, but after participating at an academicially oriented, highly repsected parohial school, found that many of the children there were not well rounded either.

 

Oh, and my kids are unschoolers who study Latin, Greek, upper level sciences, and take classes.

 

 

Squeaky wheels get the grease.

 

Why didn't you show up at the school when your voicemails were ignored?  Why didn't you make a fuss in person when your son was flunked for turning in his "E"xcellent work late after you made arrangements with the school for independent study?  Obviously, the vice principal & the grading teacher did not talk to each other and work out this plan together.  Why didn't you protest?

 

You can't homeschool if you're not adequately educated to do the job.  I admire you for your honest self-assessment about your skills.  That means that you've got to MAKE the school perform better.  You have certain rights if your kids have been accepted into a special ed program.  You just get on down to that school & make it clear that you're not going to shut up until they do the things they have to do to get your son educated.

I learned Algebra from a coach as well.  I also remember not learning History because I hated the teacher.  I was too naive to know it at the time, but the teacher made a pass (more than once) at me and I was afraid of him.  I wish I could remember details, if I did, I would try to make it known.  But if he was doing it then, I can only hope that he's either been caught or is dead by now.  Parents think they know their kids teachers so well because they attend PTA and other meetings.  Consider this...the spouses of most married petaphiles (sorrry for the spelling) do not even know that they are married to such warped individuals.  If the spouse is that clueless, what makes you think you know your kids' teachers and coaches?  Yes, we all have to worry about it regardless of how we educate, but there is a reason why these types hang out or seek employment with and around children.  It is sad that we can't trust our teachers and coaches but when your kid is homeschooled, you are always more available to be where your child is, unlike afterschool activities that most parents don't even get out of the car for.