Topic : 12/25 Parent Trap

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Created on : Friday, October 26, 2007, 02:49:00 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Air Date: 10/29/07) Fraud. lies. conspiracy. They may sound like the latest Washington scandal, but these are allegations of exes at war over child support. Dr. Phil's guests claim they became victims of the perfect crime when they were led to believe they fathered a child that was not biologically their own and were forced to pay. First up, Enrique says he was shocked and angered to discover he was not the father of his youngest daughter, Selina, and that she was conceived during his ex-wife, Maria's, adulterous affair. Maria says he raised Selina but then abandoned her to save money. Why does Maria say Enrique's current wife is to blame for the fractured relationship? Next, 13-year-old Selina speaks one on one with Dr. Phil. Will she decide to let the man she once called Daddy back in her life? Then, Carnell Smith, who uses the online moniker, "Man4Justice," suffered a similar fate to Enrique, and but he fought and won. He says he's tired of seeing women trap men and get away with it. A heated debate ensues between him and feminist attorney, Gloria Allred, who argues that men like Enrique should continue to act as the father ... and continue paying! Talk about the show here.


Find out what happened on the show.


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October 30, 2007, 10:19 am PDT

Spoken with the wisdom of Solomon!

Quote From: club1icon

I watched last night's Dr. Phil show with undivided attention because this situation truely infuriates me.

 

A little about me - I am an unmarried, 32 year old male.  I do not have any kids, so a lot of my viewpoints are black and white.  And there is very little of a "grey area" with me, if any at all.

 

Now, although I agree that 10-year-old Selina needed to be told that Enrique was not her bio-father, I do not agree with how he went about telling her (just the two of them at the playground).  I think all parties should have sat down together along with a family doctor and discussed the situation.  To totally cut-off all relations with Selina was a bad decision on Enrique's part and I believe he did admit that on the show.

 

Here's the one thing that troubled me though.  Is the cheating ex-wife, Maria, more interested in Selina's child-support payments or a relationship between Enrique/Selina?  Carnell was eluding to that question, but of course, a commercial break had to be taken and that question was not explored further when the show resumed.  During the whole show, Maria played the Selina/Enrique "relationship" card the most.  The question Dr. Phil or Canell or someone should have asked Maria:

 

"If Selina and Enrique continue to have a relationship, would it be acceptable for the child-support payments to stop?"

 

Answering this question would determine Maria's intentions:

  1. If Maria said 'yes', then she truely wants Selina to have a relationship with Enrique, regardless of any outside factors (e.g. money).
  2. If Maria said 'no', then she is definitely more interested in the money than the Selina/Enrique relationship.

My bet would be on Maria saying 'no'.  She just didn't get it.  Throughout the entire show, she had a grin/smile on her face and that disgusted me.  I was happy to see Enrique's wife shut her up by saying none of this was a laughing matter.  Maria needs to wake up and face the fact that Enrique owes Selina nothing because she is not his bio-daughter.  In fact, if I were Enrique, I would sue her for unjust enrichment.

 

Like I said in the beginning of this bulletin, I am a 32-year-old, unmarried, kid-less male.  Situations like this scare me to death, which is why my choice is never to get married or have kids of my own.  Some of my friends and/or people I tell this to say I am being selfish.  Who am I being selfish to - a future girlfriend I've never met, an unborn child, who?

 

I wish all the guests good luck & I seriously hope Maria gets professional help.

Good to get a male perspective on this board.  The Solomon- like test to prove where the heart of the mother lies would have probably produced a failure on her part.  She already stated that she has no interest in the 2 of them having a relationship.  Did you see the enjoyment on her face when he said that he regrets that he cut his daughter out of his life?  She was beaming.  Selina is the knife that she is using to stab Enrique in the heart once again. 

 

 (Not that I agree with his handling of the situation either!)

 

 
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October 30, 2007, 10:22 am PDT

it happened to us

My husband and our family are living this nightmare.  It seems my husband was the only one in town that thought his daughter was his, yet no one spoke up.  We still wouldn't have known if his oldest son hadn't stood up to his mother and made her tell us.  She contacted the biological father, he paid for the DNA test, she told the daughter.  The biological father  then started  spending time with the girl while my husband never missed a child support payment.  This was going on for a couple of months before the ex-wife called my husband on the daughters' 16th birthday to tell him he was not her father.  We live in different cities so we didn't know this was going on.  You don't think evil exists???  We contacted our lawyer and was advised to stop paying the child support and he drew up the papers.  We are suing her for fraud, support already paid and damages.  My husband has maintained contact with the child by phone and loves her very much.  This has to be done behind her mother's back because to quote her "if you don't pay child support, you can't see her until she turns 18".  Like Maria, she has no clue the hurt and damage she has caused.  She will call and leave messages about how much her real father is doing for the child and what a loser my husband is for not continuing to pay.   For her it is all about the money, if it wasn't then she wouldn't keep my husband from seeing her.   We don't know why she waited 16 years to contact the biological father, at this point she has told so many lies she probably has forgotten the truth.  The lawyers keep changing the court dates so we haven't seen the judge yet.  Please keep us in your thoughts and prayers as we navigate through this mess.
 
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October 30, 2007, 10:23 am PDT

I support Enrique and Men like him

First off, my heart goes out to Selina. She is a beautiful child caught up in the lies of one adult...her mother. It was very apparent that she still loves the only father (Enrique) that she has known all her life. I hope she can one day understand his pain and some how mend their relationship. She seems to harbor a great deal of anger towards Enrique rather than her mother. Enrique was being bashed to death for something he did not start. Hello, all of this is the mother's fault. She lied to her husband and her child for ten years. I do not feel that it's right for him to pay child support for the child that is not his and Maria should be made to pay him back. Where is the biological father? Why is Maria protecting him/ was there more than one man? Doesn't Selina have a right to know who he is? I do not agree with the way Enrique told Selina, I thought it rather thoughtless. He should not have terminated his relationship with her. Maria it seems is not about her child but herself. To her its one big joke. She knew from day one it was not Enrique's child, her plan was to make everyone believe that it was to save her marriage. Maria never thought her secret would be discovered. I'm a woman and women like Maria make me sick to my stomach. Take responsibility for your actions. I'm also a wife and mother who like Maria slept with another man. My husband is not the father of my third child. I never lied to my husband, I told him the truth the minute I found out that I was pregnant. My husband and I are still together after twenty years. We along with my child's father  who pays child support continues to raise the child. Maria is not the first or last woman to find herself in this situation. However, the truth must always be told. I feared telling my husband but the fear of living a life of lies and being discovered was much to great to handle. Lawyer Gloria, needs to shut up! Right is Right, Wrong is Wrong! I'm sure she wouldn't want to be paying child support for a child that's not hers. If she doesn't mind tell her to pay Enriques' child support to Maria every month. The whole entire situation is messed up. The step father seems like a nice guy but still the child needs to know about her biological father. Because of her mother's deceit, the child has been deprived. Yet, everyone is blaming Enrique. I support Enrique and any man that is being made to pay child support for a child(ren) that are not theirs. It's not Right, and it's not Fair!

 

 

 

 
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October 30, 2007, 10:23 am PDT

Parent Trap

I agree with Mr. Smith, "she was woman enough to have an affair, she should be woman enough to pay the consequences!" Good for Mr. Smith! That's sad he had to spend time in jail, I cannot believe that judge did that and I hope Mr. Smith goes on to become a lawyer or at least a child advocate for the courts! I am happy to see men out there like this! Why don't we have laws that make sure the man has the right DNA before he is put through all that since we cannot prevent people from having affairs and lying? If I were that little girl, I would be pissed at my mom! I would of been hurt that I was told so abruptly (seems like he wanted to hurt the ex through the child and that's immature) in the park but it would only affect me long term if my mom's ex would not want to see me anymore after things had calmed down. No, I know he should not pay child support and in a perfect world, she should pay him back every penny! But they can be in court forever and I would be surprised if a precedent happened. It would take a lot of dad's to bring stuff like this to courts for things to change. Mom is extremely lucky she had a decent man at all in her little girl's life for so long and should be thanking him and feeling remorse for teaching the daughter this kind of behavior is acceptable in women. Women do get the upper hand in court and I don't get it either. I have seen women trick and alienate the fathers and then turn around and blame everything on the father. The kids grow up thinking their dad's are awful, everything in their lives is this man's fault and mom is perfect.
 
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October 30, 2007, 10:29 am PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: club1icon

I watched last night's Dr. Phil show with undivided attention because this situation truely infuriates me.

 

A little about me - I am an unmarried, 32 year old male.  I do not have any kids, so a lot of my viewpoints are black and white.  And there is very little of a "grey area" with me, if any at all.

 

Now, although I agree that 10-year-old Selina needed to be told that Enrique was not her bio-father, I do not agree with how he went about telling her (just the two of them at the playground).  I think all parties should have sat down together along with a family doctor and discussed the situation.  To totally cut-off all relations with Selina was a bad decision on Enrique's part and I believe he did admit that on the show.

 

Here's the one thing that troubled me though.  Is the cheating ex-wife, Maria, more interested in Selina's child-support payments or a relationship between Enrique/Selina?  Carnell was eluding to that question, but of course, a commercial break had to be taken and that question was not explored further when the show resumed.  During the whole show, Maria played the Selina/Enrique "relationship" card the most.  The question Dr. Phil or Canell or someone should have asked Maria:

 

"If Selina and Enrique continue to have a relationship, would it be acceptable for the child-support payments to stop?"

 

Answering this question would determine Maria's intentions:

  1. If Maria said 'yes', then she truely wants Selina to have a relationship with Enrique, regardless of any outside factors (e.g. money).
  2. If Maria said 'no', then she is definitely more interested in the money than the Selina/Enrique relationship.

My bet would be on Maria saying 'no'.  She just didn't get it.  Throughout the entire show, she had a grin/smile on her face and that disgusted me.  I was happy to see Enrique's wife shut her up by saying none of this was a laughing matter.  Maria needs to wake up and face the fact that Enrique owes Selina nothing because she is not his bio-daughter.  In fact, if I were Enrique, I would sue her for unjust enrichment.

 

Like I said in the beginning of this bulletin, I am a 32-year-old, unmarried, kid-less male.  Situations like this scare me to death, which is why my choice is never to get married or have kids of my own.  Some of my friends and/or people I tell this to say I am being selfish.  Who am I being selfish to - a future girlfriend I've never met, an unborn child, who?

 

I wish all the guests good luck & I seriously hope Maria gets professional help.

Good for you but don't be so hard on yourself , just be very careful.
 
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October 30, 2007, 10:30 am PDT

Simple

I completey agree that the money is secondary... What really upset me enough to register and post a message the minute I watched it on my PVR was that the idea that with the money being secondary... immediately that seemed to mean that the dad (which he is) was the one who should just pay and get the relationship back on track.  The money is secondary and at this point, the MOTHER should be the one that absolutely refuses to take a dime from a man who did nothing but love and care for another mans child.  No one who has not dealt with the pain he must feel should judge him for the mistakes and bad judgement he used.  He has admitted the pain he has caused her he has said it is his biggest regret, you can see that he would love to have her in his life.  The MOTHER is making the situation about money, she is of course going to be the biggest influence in what both daughters feel and she is making sure they feel the same anomosity she feels.  Its simple, she should make sure both daughters know the mistake she made caused all the pain in this family when she lied.  The fact that this mother would even ask for money from this man shows all of us how discusting and self involved even mothers can be.  The mother has made him the bad guy by putting him in a position to have to feel if he does not pay he is an awful father and she will make sure both her daughters know that.  He has paid a price higher than any dollar value could cost him while MOMMY sits back recruiting her dauhters to believe her twisted beliefs
 
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October 30, 2007, 10:31 am PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: jelebean1

Are you saying it is more the woman's responsibility to provide and take care of the child?
I think the point of the statement was that women have a greater responsibility to be forthcoming about paternity. It is always both parents who should be responsible to provide for the child.
 
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October 30, 2007, 10:40 am PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

 

I would propose the following though not perfect:

1.   Legal action would be instituted to require paternity testing on all births.  (this would verify that the person listed on the birth certificate was the biological father) 

2.   Knowingly listing an incorrect individual as the father would be a felony and subject to serious and manditory fines, and prison time.

 

In this situation:

 

1.   Visitation rights would be granted to the "father"

2.   The "father" would pay a percentage (say 1%) of any state minimum child support.

3.   The mother would have to re-pay any child support received to date.

5.   The mother would be required to contact the biological father (if known)

6.   The biological father would be required to pay child support: from current date forward OR back child  support IF he knew that the child was his at the time of birth.  OR had cause to know and did not pursue paterinty testing.

 

That is my thought for what it is worth.

 

 
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October 30, 2007, 10:42 am PDT

MARIA IS A HORRIBLE! She should be ashamed of herself!

I cannot believe that Maria said "well, he didn't ask (if it was his), so I didn't tell". What would make him ask his pregnant wife if it's his?? Maria, you are horrible! I am so glad that Mia put her in her place. Good for Mia! Maria is a liar - she knew from the very beginning that it may not be his. Enrique should be paid back all child support he has ever paid. Maria should be ashamed of herself. Enrique probably had a hard time looking at Silena and seeing another man's child, so sort of understandable he cut off contact. Maria needs to tell Silena who her real father is so she can start a relationship with him.  Also, Silena sounded like a Robot - like a "mini-Maria" when she spoke. The poor girl has been listening to her lying, manipulative mother for so long, she sounds like her now!

 
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October 30, 2007, 10:45 am PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Selina's mom should be completely ASHAMED of herself!!!!!  She has no right to hold Enrique responsible for child support!  She should have never even asked for it!!! This whole mess  is no one's fault but her OWN!!!  How dare you judge him when you are the one that was deceitful, dishonest, manipulative and immoral.  Did she ever stop to put herself in his shoes?  No, because she is a selfish, greety b#@*h!!!  How would she feel if she was the one betrayed in SEVERAL, BIG ways!!!??  She wouldn't want a relationship with the child either b/c the pain that she would feel everytime she looked at that child would be awful!!!!!!  And it would symbolize betrayal and emotional pain and loss!  If that happened to me, first I would leave that person just for betraying me.  Then you add a child to the mix and that is a triple sword.  PUT YOURSELF IN HIS SHOES!!!   And no, Enrique should not have told Selina the way he did.  He should have left it up to the mom, so that she could see the pain that SHE has caused her family.  And you can't fault him in needing time to decide if he could emotionally handle a relationship with Selina.  The fact that even wants to at this point is pretty big of him, considering the hurt that comes along with it!! 

I cannot even believe the lack of remorse on the mother's part!!!!!!  What kind of person are you?  Obviously one that has no heart and has seriously lost their moral compass!!!!!  Not only should the mom be apologizing to Enrique (and dropping the child support request)  but she should be apologizing to her children for tearing their family apart!!!!   And you know for sure that she is making the situation worst by badmouthing Enrique and blaming him.  You can't tell me that Selina would have felt that Enrique stepped out of the picture because of money if her mom had not been putting that idea in her head!  Once again she is making Selina deal with adult problems and once again putting the blame on someone other than herself.

Her claim that Enrique should not have stopped his relationship with Enrique is a load of CRAP!!!  She doesn't actually care about that at all which she makes obvious by asking for child support and continuing to bitch about it!!  But she cannot hold the biological father responsible for child support either because that is another person she has decieved.  It is not his responsibility to pay for her deceipt either.  Though you would hope he would want a relationship with her, does he even know she exists???

Enrique, Selina, the biological father, and the other daughter are the victims here!! The mother has no right to claim any victimazation!!!!  I feel INCREDIBLY bad for Selina!!!  Because of what really in the end her mom is to blame for!  And I feel bad for her sister and Enrique.  There is not a question that Enrique loves her.  But dealing with the pain may be more than most people can bare. 

 
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