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Topic : 06/08 Mind Control?

Number of Replies: 190
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Created on : Friday, October 31, 2008, 04:13:15 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 11/05/08) It’s hard to believe, but in America alone, there may be as many as 5,000 religious groups preying upon the weak and vulnerable, and all in the name of God. Dr. Phil’s guests have warnings for you and your children. Seeta says when her 18-year-old daughter joined a religious group called 1 Mind Ministries, she left home with her 7-month-old son and never returned. Soon afterward, Seeta received the horrifying news that her grandson was found dead and her daughter was being charged with murder. Learn the disturbing details of this case and why Seeta says her daughter is innocent. Then, meet Norman, a college-educated husband and father who moved his family hundreds of miles to join a religious group that came with a price he says he never expected. Norman says he was enticed to join the House of Yahweh because of his strong desire to be part of a group. The House of Yahweh is a mysterious organization out of Abilene, Texas, led by Yisrayl Hawkins, a man who some say has more than 30 wives. As Norman and his family prepared for the end of the world, as Yisrayl Hawkins preached, Norman says he eventually realized why they were selected to join the group. You won’t believe the reason he gives! Then, meet a former wife of Yisrayl Hawkins, and learn the warning signs of mind control. Talk about the show here.

Find out what happened on the show.

As of January, 2009, this message board will become "Read Only" and will be closed to further posting. Please join the NEW Dr. Phil Community to continue your discussions, personalize your message board experience, start a blog and meet new friends.

November 17, 2008, 12:42 pm CST

misinformed

Quote From: meme22

I was as sincere a "Christian" woman as anyone could ever have been from the age of 16 through 45.  And I never once felt at home within it.  I stuck to the basics according to the records words of Christ, but felt like an anomaly with each of the various churches/denominations I tried. I gave myself to it, genuinely loved people but received only conditional love back.  I served tirelessing on committees, pray sincerely for people, gave and never asked for anything in return, and still came to see it for what it truly is.  It's a sham for the most part and , a crutch that I don't need, and realize I never needed.  If it works for you, good on you.  But, if you open your eyes to history, you'll see that Christianity is just one of the foremost religious of this world over centuries, that has been the cause for the death of innocent people (especially free thinking women), wars, political upheaval (and not for the better) and other ignominious things.   I believe, with all I've studied and personally experienced, that this world would be ten times better without religion at all, and especially without Christianity.  I know my life is. And my family's life is.   Because, the truth set us free from all of it's nonsense and mind control. 

 

If Christianity were the panacea you proffer, then it is failing miserably, isn't it?   Jerks in public ministry have cast judgment on 3000 people killed during 9/11 and others killed in hurricanes.  Who the heck are these bastions of malice and hate who are held up as "Christian" leaders.    They make my case for me.  

 

The only love I've ever had within humanity in my 51 years has not come from professing Christians.  In fact the worst treatment, judgement, condemnation, and withholding of help has come from professing Christians.   I fnd that those who are smart enough to not submit to its mind control, or have been spewed from its midst due to nonconformity are the ones who have shown me love, joy, peace and acceptance.  I am glad to be free of its clutches, and so is my pocketbook, my healthy, my well-being,my peace of mind, and my enduring friendships.  Good riddance. 

 

We don't need religion, we need love and acceptance.   Religion talks about it, but it doesn't offer that.  Period.

If you were a christian from 16 to 45 and you never felt you were part of it why did you remain in it for so long? Why did you jump from church to church and denomination? I do not attend a church for that very reason. I attended one church and I realized that most of the congregation was not truly a christian, I guess I came to the realization sooner than you. I agree that many people who profess to be christians are really not and as far as christian leaders and ministers, we have had wolves in sheeps clothing since time began. This takes place in any organized group religious or not. As far as Christianity causing wars and death God did not create this,. humans created it. Did you ever stop to think just maybe that if we had no religion attall the world could be ten times worse??? People would have no moral compass attall and Im sure this would give license to anyone to do anything. Im sorry you feel that christians have never offerred you unconditional love or support. You say you have recieved the worst treatment, judgement, and condemnation from people calling themselves Christians. All I can say is you are talking to the wrong christians, because anyone that would judge another or show condemnation is NOT a Christian. Christianity is a way of conducting your life, not going to church, not giving money, just living your life with compassion and respect for others and their beliefs. Your last statement, "We dont need religions, we need love and acceptance" Yes religion talks about it but it is people who translate this and put it to work in their own lives. I hope you get to experience a true christian like myself who only offers compassion.

Your message is very insulting to true Christians and you sound very bitter and angry.

Wishing you peace and love

Jemella a true christian

 
November 17, 2008, 12:49 pm CST

dumb sheep??

Quote From: meme22

Well, ya know, diverting attention from the heart of the matter by addressing the manner in which it is said is something that cults and abusers do.  It's deflecting and unproductive.  If you want to take issue with how someone got a point across and didn't mince words, try reading what Jesus said of the religious leaders of his time in the Christian folklore of Matthew 23.  I guess he would have been more credble if he hadn't been so forthright.  Geez....

 

Things that offend little usually don't educate much.  And vice versa.  It is those things which are sometimes hardest to hear, that must be said.   And if it spoils the argument it only does so for those who wouldn't have "got it" even if had been delivered on a silver platter with silk-gloved clad hands.  I'll say it again...people are dumb sheep.  Cults and the mind control exercised by religious institutions of all persuasions are the only proof that anyone needs.  (Not to say there aren't other examples, but the topic here is the mind control of religion.)

 

Sometimes the best way to be compassionate is to wake people up like thunder.  Even that which is recorded in the gospels of the Christian folklore has profuse examples of this in the purported words of Christ.   You think he was put to death because he kept quiet about his revolutionary, woman-freeing, anti religious statements.? No way.  He was killed because he railed against exactly what has evolved over time snce his demise, as being linked to his name.  Quite the irony.   He condemned with his words exactly what "Christianity" became within years of his demise, and only become worse over the centuries.

 

If people weren't dumb sheep, then men could not make their abudant living off controlling them, and that includes even the most benign "acceptable"  mainstream church.  Think about it.  There are as many brands of Christianities as there are men making their livings off of "teaching" their version, myriad "theosophies" within and across all denominations, and compeition or rancor among neighborhood churches that all profess the same Christ, than you can shake a stick at.  For Pete's sake,  in my 30 years wasted in that kind of nonsense, I never once attended a "Christian" service that didn't include taking up money.  Hello?    What more proof do we need that people are dumb sheep than a cursory glance at all of this nonsense all around us? 

 

 

I just want to say that some people who are controlled and brainwashed were not able to think for themselves like my son who had  a brain injury. This message is so hurtful to me and Im sure many other people out there. You talk about compassion I dont believe you know anything about compassion because someone that does know would never call the mentally challenged or weak dumb sheep. thats just plain mean.

Wishing you peace and light

Jemella

 
November 18, 2008, 7:40 am CST

IBLP - Rick Ross warns of this one also!

I would really love to see Dr. Phil look into the Institute of Basic Life Principles (IBLP).  This group is one that hides behind religion, but some of the ideas that the founder Bill Gothard teaches have been known to lead to spiritual and emtional abuse of the people that become trapped into the system.  There are even reports of physical abuse at one of the "Training Centers" that the group operates, where "troubled teens" are sent.

 

There is also info about this group on Rick Ross's site that Dr. Phil recommends.

 
November 25, 2008, 9:31 am CST

Agree . . . tv family and religious control

Quote From: acdowd

Dr. Phil,

I watched part of "17 Kids and Counting" on TLC this week, and I was alarmed by what I believe is children whose minds are being controlled by their parents.  After seeing your show today, I believe the Duggar family does display mind control at work.

 

1.  The children in this family are completely isolated from the outside world.  The parents in order to promote their strict religious doctrines do not allow their children to watch television or browse the internet.  They are also homeschooled so they are not exposed to ideas outside of their parents' views.

2.  The children's sense of identity is diminished by the fact that they are one of 17 children.  There is no way each child is getting special attention when they are one of so many.  Their identity has become "one of the Duggar children"

3.  Further evidence of the control was exhibited when the children interviewed were asked their views about dating and relationships.  According to their parents, it is best not to date, but rather find the one person you are intended to marry, get engaged, and then begin the courtship phase.  Also, during the courtship, the couple does not even kiss because the parents have told them that it is best to save the first kiss for the wedding.  This constant suppression of one's natural instincts has got to be harming the children.

 

Dr. Phil, I worry about the children in this family, and I think your show could be a good format for investigating their welfare.  I certainly promote a parent's choice to instill their personal values in their children, but when those children are not allowed to gain any other information outside of their parents in order to form their own beliefs, I believe a line is crossed.

I have to agree with the person who posted this info on the show "17 kids and counting", which is about the Duggar family.  This family is part of the IBLP group founded by Bill Gothard.  Do a search on the internet about Bill Gothard or IBLP, and I assure you that you will find a LOT of information about people who have been through emotional and spiritual abuse through this group.  I would LOVE to see Dr Phil dig further into this group and their teachings. 

 

I have a family member who has gotten involved with this group and like the quoted post, she moved VERY quickly through the marriage process.  The man came and met the family one month, and we were all told that they were just friends . . . not even dating.  A few weeks later, they were "courting" and in less than 4 months from when this man was introduced to the family as "just a friend" they were married. 

 
November 25, 2008, 11:19 am CST

The House of Yahweh

My husbands two uncles are in The House of Yahweh. He tried really hard to get us into the cult. I say it is a cult because I saw a little of what goes on. His uncle wanted us to go to the compound in Texas but since we refused he got really angry with us. Just by the way I was treated in the short stay at his uncles house I was really scared for the women and children in there.
 
November 25, 2008, 2:35 pm CST

Just thought I'd share my thoughts

Quote From: doomsdaydiva

Kids turn to drugs because they're not religious? That is so incorrect. Kids turn to drugs for many reasons-emotional problems, peer pressure, the fact that they think they're immortal, but I have yet to hear anyone say "I got addicted to crystal meth because I didn't  go to church every Sunday." I for one am sick of religious people always making the assumption that because I am not religious I must be very morally impaired and go out murdering and stealing or whatever. I am not perfect, but I don't drink, I've never smoked, and I absolutely hate drugs. But I guess none of that matters unless I'm begging God for mercy in a church, does it??

I think jewelsf was misunderstood.  She didn't mean lack of religion is the ONE AND ONLY reason kids turn to drugs.  It is the lack of religion that makes it more likely.  What I mean by that, a kid who is raised up in church will be more likely to turn to SOMEONE who will help them instead of  SOMETHING  that will ruin them.  Before I get slammed for that statement let me say kids who don't have religious upbringing are entitled to the same as those that do. 

 

You also said you are sick of religious people always making the assumption that because you are not religious you must be very morally impaired and go out murdering and stealing or whatever. That is nothing more than your assumption of what others think about you. So let me share a quote that I read in an email once.  It said, "what others think about you is none of your business!" However, you have the ability to control their first impression by your words and actions. What frustrates are those that lack religion making the assumption that ALL religious people are out to ridicule and judge them!  That's not what Christianity is about and I sorry if you had a bad experience.  It is no one's place to judge but God's. 

 

It goes without say, no one is perfect!  Not even Pastors are perfect as odd as that may sound.  Why is that people think to be a Christian you have to be perfect?  I am living proof that you don't. Honestly, you can't!  Christian's are humans, too and humans are not perfect.  That is the whole point of striving, is it not?

 

 
November 26, 2008, 6:57 pm CST

You've been on my heart

Quote From: meme22

I was as sincere a "Christian" woman as anyone could ever have been from the age of 16 through 45.  And I never once felt at home within it.  I stuck to the basics according to the records words of Christ, but felt like an anomaly with each of the various churches/denominations I tried. I gave myself to it, genuinely loved people but received only conditional love back.  I served tirelessing on committees, pray sincerely for people, gave and never asked for anything in return, and still came to see it for what it truly is.  It's a sham for the most part and , a crutch that I don't need, and realize I never needed.  If it works for you, good on you.  But, if you open your eyes to history, you'll see that Christianity is just one of the foremost religious of this world over centuries, that has been the cause for the death of innocent people (especially free thinking women), wars, political upheaval (and not for the better) and other ignominious things.   I believe, with all I've studied and personally experienced, that this world would be ten times better without religion at all, and especially without Christianity.  I know my life is. And my family's life is.   Because, the truth set us free from all of it's nonsense and mind control. 

 

If Christianity were the panacea you proffer, then it is failing miserably, isn't it?   Jerks in public ministry have cast judgment on 3000 people killed during 9/11 and others killed in hurricanes.  Who the heck are these bastions of malice and hate who are held up as "Christian" leaders.    They make my case for me.  

 

The only love I've ever had within humanity in my 51 years has not come from professing Christians.  In fact the worst treatment, judgement, condemnation, and withholding of help has come from professing Christians.   I fnd that those who are smart enough to not submit to its mind control, or have been spewed from its midst due to nonconformity are the ones who have shown me love, joy, peace and acceptance.  I am glad to be free of its clutches, and so is my pocketbook, my healthy, my well-being,my peace of mind, and my enduring friendships.  Good riddance. 

 

We don't need religion, we need love and acceptance.   Religion talks about it, but it doesn't offer that.  Period.

Hi meme22,

I decided to reply because your post really struck my interest. This is actually my 3rd or 4th attempt to reply. On my second attempt, I finished and hit "post," then I had to sign in again and as you know it cleared my entire message. So frustrated, I thought to myself "oh, just forget it" but something wouldn't let me "just forget it." Have you ever had something just tug and tug at you until you acknowledge it?

 

I would like to apologize for you being made to feel like an anomaly by what were supposed to be your fellow Christians. That's not what Christianity is supposed to be about. We as Christians, are supposed to encourage and guide one another. When you say you "only received conditional love back" what exactly do you mean by that? What religion were you and how do you view God now, if you don't mind me asking?

You speak of Christianity as one religion but there are many different branches so-to-speak. There's Catholic, Baptist, Lutheran, Mormon, etc.

 

You made mention that Christianity is a cult. Well, not necessarily. There definitely are cult-like organizations in most religions but not all forms of religion are cults. Having refreshed my memory on the definition, I can see why you would think that though. I found this link and thought it to be interesting. I read it if you'd like. http://www.essortment.com/all/whatisdefiniti_rjli.htmI I am considered Quaker, which is a lot like Baptist. We believe Jesus is the Savior of the world and we focus on a one-on-one relationship with Him and Him only. We believe in the Trinity (that Jesus, God and the Holy Spirit are 3 in 1), which is extremely confusing for some. I can honestly say, even I don't know how to adequately explain it. We read the Holy Bible, although, I don't recommend the King James Version, it's confusing. I prefer the NIV. I don't want to bore you too much with our doctrine, just want you to know where I come from.

 

I am not here to judge. My motto is judge not lest ye be judged. I used to be the most judgmental person. I thought my way was the right and only way and couldn't understand why others disagreed. It wasn't until I started reading these boards that I realized, there are so many different types of people and they all have a right to choose what they want to believe. I am a firm believer that whatever measure one uses to judge they will be judged to that measure. Matthew 7:2 The fact remains, I can't tell you to get the speck of sawdust out of your eye until I get the plank out of my own eye. Matthew 7:3-5

 

Anyway,  I'm sure you are wishing I would shut up.  I'm almost done.  I just wanted you to know that not all Christians speak for me, as I'm sure I don't speak for them.  If there ever came a time when you needed someone's support and encouragement you are more than welcome to email me at shellygirl80@verizon.net.  I'm sure you have family and friends you confide in but you can add me to the list, if you'd like. 

 

Sincerely,

Michelle

 
November 26, 2008, 8:09 pm CST

tithing

Quote From: meme22

Well, ya know, diverting attention from the heart of the matter by addressing the manner in which it is said is something that cults and abusers do.  It's deflecting and unproductive.  If you want to take issue with how someone got a point across and didn't mince words, try reading what Jesus said of the religious leaders of his time in the Christian folklore of Matthew 23.  I guess he would have been more credble if he hadn't been so forthright.  Geez....

 

Things that offend little usually don't educate much.  And vice versa.  It is those things which are sometimes hardest to hear, that must be said.   And if it spoils the argument it only does so for those who wouldn't have "got it" even if had been delivered on a silver platter with silk-gloved clad hands.  I'll say it again...people are dumb sheep.  Cults and the mind control exercised by religious institutions of all persuasions are the only proof that anyone needs.  (Not to say there aren't other examples, but the topic here is the mind control of religion.)

 

Sometimes the best way to be compassionate is to wake people up like thunder.  Even that which is recorded in the gospels of the Christian folklore has profuse examples of this in the purported words of Christ.   You think he was put to death because he kept quiet about his revolutionary, woman-freeing, anti religious statements.? No way.  He was killed because he railed against exactly what has evolved over time snce his demise, as being linked to his name.  Quite the irony.   He condemned with his words exactly what "Christianity" became within years of his demise, and only become worse over the centuries.

 

If people weren't dumb sheep, then men could not make their abudant living off controlling them, and that includes even the most benign "acceptable"  mainstream church.  Think about it.  There are as many brands of Christianities as there are men making their livings off of "teaching" their version, myriad "theosophies" within and across all denominations, and compeition or rancor among neighborhood churches that all profess the same Christ, than you can shake a stick at.  For Pete's sake,  in my 30 years wasted in that kind of nonsense, I never once attended a "Christian" service that didn't include taking up money.  Hello?    What more proof do we need that people are dumb sheep than a cursory glance at all of this nonsense all around us? 

 

 

I too disagree when pastor practically dun you for money.  That's not right.  I watched a Joyce Meyers sermon on tv and that's all she talked about.  I've never watched her since.  But I do consider tithing like this: I choose to think of it as paying your light or water bill.  If you don't pay, your lights and water get turned off. In the same way if no one tithed, the church wouldn' be able to stay open. I hope I don't insult your  intelligence but tithing doesn't go straight to the pastor; it goes toward paying bills and those that are on the payroll and whatever else . Tithing is pretty tricky I think.  Most people think you should be required to tithe but I think it is what anyone feels in their heart.  Like youR relationship, your tithing is between YOU AND GOD.

 
November 28, 2008, 1:08 pm CST

Mind Control

I had to laugh when I saw the title of this show and the content. I so thought it was going to be about Obama. Do you see the blank looks in the eyes of the crowds that form around him? It is sooo scary!! Obama could definitely be a cult leader. Definitely.
 
December 29, 2008, 6:26 pm CST

Obama could be a cult leader too ???

Quote From: kobesnana

I had to laugh when I saw the title of this show and the content. I so thought it was going to be about Obama. Do you see the blank looks in the eyes of the crowds that form around him? It is sooo scary!! Obama could definitely be a cult leader. Definitely.
 what do you mean 'could' be... sorry for the frank reply but drrrr !!!  I think he has succeeded well in brain washing his little followers !!!  I can't believe rational men actually believe they will go to HEAVEN or whatever they call it, when they have committed the ultimate sin of murder - doesn't make any sense to me what-so-ever.

I would like to hear from people regarding Landmark Education and their experiences with it.  If you have any interesting stories, either in support or protest against, I would love to hear from you.  I've had a few people here in Australia sucked into The Forum, and I really don't like what they stand for.  They prey on the valunarable and are making millions each year all around the world - kinda doesn't make sense either does it... if they are their for the people, why not give back to the people by donating some of them millions to charities ???
 
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