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Topic : 06/08 Mind Control?

Number of Replies: 190
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Created on : Friday, October 31, 2008, 04:13:15 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 11/05/08) It’s hard to believe, but in America alone, there may be as many as 5,000 religious groups preying upon the weak and vulnerable, and all in the name of God. Dr. Phil’s guests have warnings for you and your children. Seeta says when her 18-year-old daughter joined a religious group called 1 Mind Ministries, she left home with her 7-month-old son and never returned. Soon afterward, Seeta received the horrifying news that her grandson was found dead and her daughter was being charged with murder. Learn the disturbing details of this case and why Seeta says her daughter is innocent. Then, meet Norman, a college-educated husband and father who moved his family hundreds of miles to join a religious group that came with a price he says he never expected. Norman says he was enticed to join the House of Yahweh because of his strong desire to be part of a group. The House of Yahweh is a mysterious organization out of Abilene, Texas, led by Yisrayl Hawkins, a man who some say has more than 30 wives. As Norman and his family prepared for the end of the world, as Yisrayl Hawkins preached, Norman says he eventually realized why they were selected to join the group. You won’t believe the reason he gives! Then, meet a former wife of Yisrayl Hawkins, and learn the warning signs of mind control. Talk about the show here.

Find out what happened on the show.

As of January, 2009, this message board will become "Read Only" and will be closed to further posting. Please join the NEW Dr. Phil Community to continue your discussions, personalize your message board experience, start a blog and meet new friends.

November 6, 2008, 11:15 am CST

Pray, pay and obey

       For too long, I attended a church/cult with a friend that was just like this cult you talked about today - their leaders were prophets that no one was to argue with, ever. Penalty was to be kicked out if someone did.
       These "profits" had a whole "you're with us or against us" brainwashing that was constantly going on. Just like the show said, the "teachings" were completely fear-based: "Do this and you'll go to heaven. Don't, and you're out. Forever."
       Everyone ratted everyone else out. "Confidential" information was gossiped about under the guise of "for your own good." The individual was made to feel that they had no worth unless others said they did. Anyone who stayed in very long lost their ability to rationally think for themselves and instead literally became a part of the hive collective - a drone who parroted whatever they were told to think, say or do. The thinking had already been done for them. If their leaders were wrong, it wasn't their concern.
       Bow your head and say Yes.
       Mormonism, that's the church/cult I was nearly sucked into. It IS a cult that stole it's super-duper secret temple rites from the Masons. Mormons who bought the anti-gay legislation victories in CA, FL and AZ this week. Mormons who are building a massive multi-BILLION dollar mall in SLC... why? Do they now worship Jesus at the alters of commerce??
       Mormons, who don't let their members simply walk away, but insist on ex-communicating everyone who crosses them UNLESS that person resigns following the procedures listed at mormonnomore Resignation, which was NOT an option until after a LEGAL COURT BATTLE in 1985 allowed Mormons in the USA to freely resign and be done with the Mormon church/cult. ...
       ... well, all the Mormons do is move their membership info from one file to another. No one can ever really leave the Mormon cult. Once you're dead, they'll do their dead dunking and re-baptize you even if you prohibit it in your will.
       You want to tackle a big, manipulative, lying CULT? Go after the ... NeoConservatives. Ha! You thought I was going to say "Mormons", didn't you?!
       Yes, the NeoConservatives are another huge CULT... if you don't believe me, ask yourself how free you are to think for yourself. How free you are to stand up to their demands. How free you are inside their CULT that demands express obedience ... "or else..."
       Just like with any other cult, the NeoConservatives demand that you "Bow your head and say Yes."

........So how do we help free those people still trapped in all these horribly destructive cults... no matter how almost-ok those cults may seem?
 
November 6, 2008, 11:50 am CST

healthy churches lead to humble hearts

Quote From: jewelsf

Although I consider myself to be a Christian, I still tend to live and think more like you than what is considered a "normal" Christian. Yes, I believe in God, but I also feel that there is a lot of hypocrisy in the church and in congregations. My husband used to attend church when he was married to his first wife many years ago and then turned away from it when he found out that the Minister was having an affair with one of his best friends wife. Just like me he still believes in God but neither of us attend church.

  I belonged to a church many years ago but have found my own way and my own spirituality. To me being a Christian is a combination of believing in the Lord and also by just being a good person. By having morals and values. I certainly don't believe that a person must attend church to be a Christian or that is the only way to the afterlife. As I said, a lot of hypocrites belong to church's and no amount of praying or attending will wash away what they have done wrong.

  Having a good heart and common sense is the obvious choice in my humble opinion. As to cults? They prey on the weak, mentally compromised and vulnerable.

 

You say some nice things here and it is a frightening tragedy to hear about a pastor having an affair.  This is a good reason to leave a church, but maybe not to throw out the baby with the bathwater?  It's not too difficult to find a healthy church with a humble pastor and this can help Christians to grow in the Lord.  Healthy Christian fellowship can be a source of companionship and support during difficult times in our lives.  One of the main themes in the Bible is to deny ourselves and if we rely on our own way and own spirituality, this can make us vulnerable to things like cults that promote totalitarian devotion to a group and leader or things like the New Age movement which promote putting ourselves before divine authority and a million other rabbit trails off the narrow path. 

It can be difficult to find a healthy balance and finding supportive Christian friends without an agenda to themselves or a group, but don't give up trying because of a lost sheep pastor who has an affair.

And prayer does change things--I've seen it happen in dramatic ways--

 

 

 
November 6, 2008, 12:08 pm CST

Wow--well said, preach it...

Quote From: 8i8dancer

       For too long, I attended a church/cult with a friend that was just like this cult you talked about today - their leaders were prophets that no one was to argue with, ever. Penalty was to be kicked out if someone did.
       These "profits" had a whole "you're with us or against us" brainwashing that was constantly going on. Just like the show said, the "teachings" were completely fear-based: "Do this and you'll go to heaven. Don't, and you're out. Forever."
       Everyone ratted everyone else out. "Confidential" information was gossiped about under the guise of "for your own good." The individual was made to feel that they had no worth unless others said they did. Anyone who stayed in very long lost their ability to rationally think for themselves and instead literally became a part of the hive collective - a drone who parroted whatever they were told to think, say or do. The thinking had already been done for them. If their leaders were wrong, it wasn't their concern.
       Bow your head and say Yes.
       Mormonism, that's the church/cult I was nearly sucked into. It IS a cult that stole it's super-duper secret temple rites from the Masons. Mormons who bought the anti-gay legislation victories in CA, FL and AZ this week. Mormons who are building a massive multi-BILLION dollar mall in SLC... why? Do they now worship Jesus at the alters of commerce??
       Mormons, who don't let their members simply walk away, but insist on ex-communicating everyone who crosses them UNLESS that person resigns following the procedures listed at mormonnomore Resignation, which was NOT an option until after a LEGAL COURT BATTLE in 1985 allowed Mormons in the USA to freely resign and be done with the Mormon church/cult. ...
       ... well, all the Mormons do is move their membership info from one file to another. No one can ever really leave the Mormon cult. Once you're dead, they'll do their dead dunking and re-baptize you even if you prohibit it in your will.
       You want to tackle a big, manipulative, lying CULT? Go after the ... NeoConservatives. Ha! You thought I was going to say "Mormons", didn't you?!
       Yes, the NeoConservatives are another huge CULT... if you don't believe me, ask yourself how free you are to think for yourself. How free you are to stand up to their demands. How free you are inside their CULT that demands express obedience ... "or else..."
       Just like with any other cult, the NeoConservatives demand that you "Bow your head and say Yes."

........So how do we help free those people still trapped in all these horribly destructive cults... no matter how almost-ok those cults may seem?

That is one of the most effective testimonies I've ever heard.  But there is a difference between secretive organizations such as the ones you mentioned and Conservative Christians.  Many conservative Christians are fanatics or extremists as you mention, but many are caring Christians who lead others to a loving,  born-again relationship with Christ and help them turn from unhealthy lifestyles and find meaning and purpose in their lives. Conservative Christians in general are certainly not a "lying cult."  I think the term "cult" as it was presented on the show pertains mainly to groups who have certain characteristics of totalitarian control that leads to mental and spiritual bondage and not to freedom in Christ.  Becoming a Christian is not supposed to put us in a cage, but to free us.  Jesus came to free people from the darkness of bondage, not to take us from one prison into another.

You have to be pretty wary to avoid even an obvious cult or a more hidden cult-mentality.  Bondage is invisible, but the signs of bondage in a person's life can be pretty obvious.  So can the signs of a free mind and heart!

 
November 6, 2008, 1:02 pm CST

11/05 Mind Control?

Quote From: freebird777

That is one of the most effective testimonies I've ever heard.  But there is a difference between secretive organizations such as the ones you mentioned and Conservative Christians.  Many conservative Christians are fanatics or extremists as you mention, but many are caring Christians who lead others to a loving,  born-again relationship with Christ and help them turn from unhealthy lifestyles and find meaning and purpose in their lives. Conservative Christians in general are certainly not a "lying cult."  I think the term "cult" as it was presented on the show pertains mainly to groups who have certain characteristics of totalitarian control that leads to mental and spiritual bondage and not to freedom in Christ.  Becoming a Christian is not supposed to put us in a cage, but to free us.  Jesus came to free people from the darkness of bondage, not to take us from one prison into another.

You have to be pretty wary to avoid even an obvious cult or a more hidden cult-mentality.  Bondage is invisible, but the signs of bondage in a person's life can be pretty obvious.  So can the signs of a free mind and heart!

    "Wolves in sheep's clothing" just like the Bible warned. Yes, we are meant to become FREE in Christ, not enslaved, and there are many good Christians trying to live as Christ taught.
    How do we wake the sleeping others? We can see the pain in their eyes - they're trapped and trying so hard to figure out why their lives hurt so much despite them doing everything they've been ordered to do. We watch them self-medicate with obsessive church/cult work, neglecting their families for their cult, buying more and more stuff, abusing plastic surgery, abusing all sorts of drugs, abusing sex, having affairs, abusing themselves and others... none of this works. All of it only makes their pain worse.
    How can we wake all these poor people up?
 
November 6, 2008, 6:02 pm CST

Parental Alienation is Mind Control

The alienating parent is compared to a cult leader.  Amy Baker has done studies on adult children of Parental Alienation and she wrote about how the alienating parent's tactics are very similar to a cult leader's tactics.  These children who have succumbed to parental alienation have been indoctorinated into a cult and they have no clue.  I know first hand about this since my children have been alienated from me.  I posted on the board for the October 3rd show on which Dr. Phil talked about parental alienation. 
 
November 6, 2008, 6:17 pm CST

11/05 Mind Control?

Quote From: jewelsf

It's nice to hear from you again. I too have friends who are JH and also my husbands brother and his wife & family are JH. I know for a fact that JH saved my brother in laws life. He found this after meeting his wife who is JH and finally settled down, no longer got into trouble. He was on the wild side, very wild! My best friend from childhood was JH and I spent a good part of my youth in her family's home. Not once did they ever try and "convert" me. Very sadly she passed away when she was 18 years old and on her way home from Prom night. It was a car accident. I too am Baptist by the way. I have another friend who is a former coworker of mine and i was so comfortable with her that I asked her all about the religion to be able to better understand it. The hardest part for me is the fact that they refuse blood transfusions. I would do anything to save a loved ones life, no matter what it went against. I have seen the Beta stuff on the home page but haven't checked it out. I guess I will now! I'll see you over there!

Take care,

Jewels

To Jewelsf and Housewife52,

I am not asking you to believe me if you don't want to about the JW's using a different Bible, all I ask it that you go to the websites I mentioned (Silentlambs and Freeminds) and research it for yourselves.  They are also taught a class on a weekly basis in lying....they call it "Theocratic Warfare Strategy."  They do not think that they have to obey man's law, because they are under Jehovah's laws....or should I say, the laws of the governing body of the WTBTS?  And if you don't believe that, google "Jehovah's Witnesses and lying in court."  AND, if you don't believe that, I have the transcript of the depositions given by my dad and his JW wife in court in Beckham County, OK.  You talk about something filled with lies, that is all it is!  The JW's are a very evil mind-controlling and pedophile protecting organization and they are being exposed as such, thanks to the internet!  Also, google "Jehovah's Witnesses" and see how many of the websites that come up are sites anti-JW......a lot more that pro-JW.  And, I do hope that we are talking about the same cult, but I really don't know what JH stands for.  Thanks and God Bless!

 
November 6, 2008, 6:42 pm CST

I certainly believe in Prayer........................

Quote From: freebird777

You say some nice things here and it is a frightening tragedy to hear about a pastor having an affair.  This is a good reason to leave a church, but maybe not to throw out the baby with the bathwater?  It's not too difficult to find a healthy church with a humble pastor and this can help Christians to grow in the Lord.  Healthy Christian fellowship can be a source of companionship and support during difficult times in our lives.  One of the main themes in the Bible is to deny ourselves and if we rely on our own way and own spirituality, this can make us vulnerable to things like cults that promote totalitarian devotion to a group and leader or things like the New Age movement which promote putting ourselves before divine authority and a million other rabbit trails off the narrow path. 

It can be difficult to find a healthy balance and finding supportive Christian friends without an agenda to themselves or a group, but don't give up trying because of a lost sheep pastor who has an affair.

And prayer does change things--I've seen it happen in dramatic ways--

 

 

  You have made some good points here. Yes, I would like to find a church that I am comfortable with. But I have to say something that will come off as sounding bad and somewhat selfish. My husband works 6 days a week in the winter, for 5 months straight, and then 7 days a week the rest of the year. The only day he ever has to sleep in is on Sunday, that is when he gets his rest. It's also the only morning that I ever have to sleep in with him and cuddle. I miss that so much! So, because of this we keep Sundays for ourselves.

  As to that minister who had an affair, that was a long time ago when my husband was married to his first wife. We've been married for 21 years now. I do believe he has gotten over it but it sure soured him for quite a few years. I'm hoping that my husband will get to retire in the next year and we will finally have some time to spend together and also to attend church together. I would certainly enjoy that and my husband has agreed to attend with me. He's just so exhausted right now, because of his job, that he just doesn't have it in him to do anything but rest when he gets the time.

  I also believe that God understands that. He knows how hard my husband works, how tired he is, and how much responsibility is resting on his shoulders. I am disabled and my husband helps to take care of me and also helps with the housework, the cooking, the bill paying, laundry, etc.. He knows that he is a good man. Plus, we have the financial burden that comes with my disability, and that is one of the reasons that my husband can't slow down, we need the health coverage plus all of the extra expense that comes along with it. I would do anything to be able to work again!

  My husband lost a son in a car accident about 18 years ago and he finds deep peace knowing that he is with the Lord. Actually, there is so much that I can tell you that has happened to us, including the scare of my life exactly one year ago when my husband collapsed in the kitchen from a heart arrhythmia. Prayer has certainly gotten me through many difficult times. And I agree with you, prayer does change things in dramatic ways, I know that for a fact!

  Sorry for rambling here.

 
November 6, 2008, 6:50 pm CST

We are!

Quote From: drmel46

To Jewelsf and Housewife52,

I am not asking you to believe me if you don't want to about the JW's using a different Bible, all I ask it that you go to the websites I mentioned (Silentlambs and Freeminds) and research it for yourselves.  They are also taught a class on a weekly basis in lying....they call it "Theocratic Warfare Strategy."  They do not think that they have to obey man's law, because they are under Jehovah's laws....or should I say, the laws of the governing body of the WTBTS?  And if you don't believe that, google "Jehovah's Witnesses and lying in court."  AND, if you don't believe that, I have the transcript of the depositions given by my dad and his JW wife in court in Beckham County, OK.  You talk about something filled with lies, that is all it is!  The JW's are a very evil mind-controlling and pedophile protecting organization and they are being exposed as such, thanks to the internet!  Also, google "Jehovah's Witnesses" and see how many of the websites that come up are sites anti-JW......a lot more that pro-JW.  And, I do hope that we are talking about the same cult, but I really don't know what JH stands for.  Thanks and God Bless!

Yes, we are talking about the same organization. I use JH instead of writing out the entire name Jehovah's Witness. Sorry if I confused you a little, but you got it. Out of curiosity I will look into what you have suggested, but don't worry, I certainly don't plan on becoming one myself in this lifetime. I was really just speaking of the people that I know who are JH. The ones that I know are good people but I won't be so closed minded to reject what you have said outright. I know that I certainly don't agree with many of their beliefs, but as long as no one is hurt I have always been a live and let live sort of person. I will check that out though. Thanks for the heads up!
 
November 6, 2008, 6:52 pm CST

Thank you!

Quote From: tinybird26

Icompletely agree sweety:) peace be with you always:)
And may peace be with you always also! BTW, I just adore nice people!
 
November 6, 2008, 6:54 pm CST

11/05 Mind Control?

Quote From: freebird777

I would like to apologize for my abusive attacks on other's religions.  The way cults deceive innocent people and lead them into bondage and mind-control makes me very angry, but abusive name calling such as calling someone's religion evil or disgusting or "doctrine of demons" is not the answer, especially not a Christian way to help someone.  Attacking someone's beliefs does not help free people from the sad bondage and mind-control of cults.  Just being their friend without being enticed into a religion that does not promote spiritual and mental freedom while praying for them and showing them what it means to have a free mind is helpful.  There are Christian ministry's that are very effective in helping people find inner freedom.  One best-selling book called "The Bondage Breaker" by Dr. Neil T. Anderson was very helpful to me and has helped thousands of people find freedom in Christ, especially Christians who feel they may not be growing spiritually or others who are in bondage to negative thinking or behavior.  One of the main themes of this book is realizing and believing that as Christians, we are children of God, and this gives us divine protection and greater freedom in Christ can be realized through completing the 7 STEPS TO FREEDOM  which is a 7-step process of actively renouncing negative things we may have done or believed in the past and turning to God.

No apology needed.
 
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