04/08 Ask Dr. Phil
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Posted by: gladdie57
Posted on: 2003-04-08 09:17:11
Dr. Phil,
Two Male members of my family have had to be circumcised as adults for medical reasons and boy was it uncomfortable! I bet they wished their Mothers had made the decision to have it done when they were babies. That Mom on the show should let it go and never mention it again so the son won't even think about it. Remember, millions of Jewish men adore their Mothers.
Posted by: gladdie57
Posted on: 2003-04-08 09:17:11
Dr. Phil,
Two Male members of my family have had to be circumcised as adults for medical reasons and boy was it uncomfortable! I bet they wished their Mothers had made the decision to have it done when they were babies. That Mom on the show should let it go and never mention it again so the son won't even think about it. Remember, millions of Jewish men adore their Mothers.
Posted by: mimomof2
Posted on: 2003-04-08 09:46:22
Do you think it's not uncomfortable for a baby? Especially one who gets no pain relief during or after? Anyone who's seen one done can tell you the babies are obviously in some serious pain. Why on earth would anyone allow surgery on their perfectly healthy infant? What parts are next? The appendix, tonsils, toes? Last time I checked it's our practice to wait until surgery is necessary to do it, why is this procedure any different?
Posted by: mimomof2
Posted on: 2003-04-08 10:25:03
Of course not. My son has all of his natural, healthy body. Problem free, just like the majority of men in this world. Why does no one want to answer the question: why is it that this is the only part of the body that you can remove from babies with inadequate/no pain relief for no other reason than to match Daddy or the neighbors? Why is anyone removing healthy parts?
Anesthetic for circumcision
Posted by: sandy826
Posted on: 2003-04-08 17:10:35
I had a terrible experience with my own first born in 1960 who couldn't be circumsised until his month checkup because he was premature. The nurse wasn't available so I had to assist and believe me that month made it a much more serious situation. I was hysterical before it was over and I thought my son would pass out or burst a blood vessel, he was totally red purple. And the doctor claimed he was just "angry." By then I knew screams of pain from anger. We recovered together and its the last time I took an expert's word over my own feelings.
However, that being said... when my daughter's first child was born, I went straight to the doctor (I was the coach) and asked about anesthetic. "Of course we use anesthetic" said the doctor. "We use a local anesthetic. I would never cut on a baby with no anesthetic." There was a bit of crying but no frantic screaming and stuggling as I'd heard before.
I think this is the question to ask, will there be anesthetic? There *are* reasons to be circumsized. For one, wives of uncircumsized men have a much higher rate of cervical cancer. For another, my uncle had penial cancer at 78 because he couldn't deal properly with his hygiene and was not circumsised. Belief me, much more was removed than foreskin in that case. I know two adult men who had to have the surgery for that reason also. So it must be a problem.
The pendulum swings. My kids suffered through many bouts of strep because tonsillectomies were not in vogue just
Posted by: sandy826
Posted on: 2003-04-08 17:10:35
I had a terrible experience with my own first born in 1960 who couldn't be circumsised until his month checkup because he was premature. The nurse wasn't available so I had to assist and believe me that month made it a much more serious situation. I was hysterical before it was over and I thought my son would pass out or burst a blood vessel, he was totally red purple. And the doctor claimed he was just "angry." By then I knew screams of pain from anger. We recovered together and its the last time I took an expert's word over my own feelings.
However, that being said... when my daughter's first child was born, I went straight to the doctor (I was the coach) and asked about anesthetic. "Of course we use anesthetic" said the doctor. "We use a local anesthetic. I would never cut on a baby with no anesthetic." There was a bit of crying but no frantic screaming and stuggling as I'd heard before.
I think this is the question to ask, will there be anesthetic? There *are* reasons to be circumsized. For one, wives of uncircumsized men have a much higher rate of cervical cancer. For another, my uncle had penial cancer at 78 because he couldn't deal properly with his hygiene and was not circumsised. Belief me, much more was removed than foreskin in that case. I know two adult men who had to have the surgery for that reason also. So it must be a problem.
The pendulum swings. My kids suffered through many bouts of strep because tonsillectomies were not in vogue just
anesthetic for circ not adequate
Posted by: birthsourc
Posted on: 2003-04-09 15:23:39
the anethestia given for sircumcision only numbs 40-50% of the pain...if they numbed it fully there's be a greater risk of gangreen and complete loss of penis. I'd rather give my son the choice when he's older and then he can have full anesthesia.
Posted by: birthsourc
Posted on: 2003-04-09 15:23:39
the anethestia given for sircumcision only numbs 40-50% of the pain...if they numbed it fully there's be a greater risk of gangreen and complete loss of penis. I'd rather give my son the choice when he's older and then he can have full anesthesia.
circumcision
Posted by: kossenw
Posted on: 2003-04-10 10:32:02
From what medical research we know that routine infant circumcisions do not decrease the rate of cervical or penile cancers. That is one of those myths some people like to propagate to justify the procedure. Also, your uncle did not develop penile cancer from lack of hygiene, otherwise many people would have developed this pathology about a hundred years ago. But they did not. Most likely, your uncle picked up an oncogenic virus that was allowed to flourish when his immunity lowered as he was aging. The point here is that people need to live healthy life styles to avoid disease. Your uncle *was*, however, in a position to enjoy *full* sexual experiences. Men and women circumcised as children *never* can! Why would any parent want to take that away from his/her child???
Posted by: kossenw
Posted on: 2003-04-10 10:32:02
From what medical research we know that routine infant circumcisions do not decrease the rate of cervical or penile cancers. That is one of those myths some people like to propagate to justify the procedure. Also, your uncle did not develop penile cancer from lack of hygiene, otherwise many people would have developed this pathology about a hundred years ago. But they did not. Most likely, your uncle picked up an oncogenic virus that was allowed to flourish when his immunity lowered as he was aging. The point here is that people need to live healthy life styles to avoid disease. Your uncle *was*, however, in a position to enjoy *full* sexual experiences. Men and women circumcised as children *never* can! Why would any parent want to take that away from his/her child???
circumcision
Posted by: taygav
Posted on: 2003-04-10 12:44:51
I understand all you are saying but I honestly can never understand how anyone can say can say (especially a woman) you cannot enjoy *full* sexual experiences when you are circumsized!My husband was circumsized as a baby and he enjoys the *full* sexual experience!My brother in law was NOT circumsized and he also enjoys *full* sexual experience with my sister in law!It is the ONLY sexual experience they know so why wouldn't it be the *full* sexual experience.I believe that every man circumsized or not enjoys the *full* sexual experience!I have a newborn son who I did NOT circumsize because I could not bare to put him through the pain,to look like his father,knowing full well there are no medical reasons to do as such, bare in mind I had full intentions on getting him circumsized until I actually seen how small it was and figured who am I to decide.I think as mothers we decide what we feel is best for our children and if one feels that circumcision is best for her son then so be it,who are we to knock her down for her decision!Here in Canada we have health coverage that one day use to pay for circumcision in newborns and now with all the medical evidence they DO NOT! Needless to say there are fewer circumsized boys for that reason, it makes you actually educate yourself on the issue.
Posted by: taygav
Posted on: 2003-04-10 12:44:51
I understand all you are saying but I honestly can never understand how anyone can say can say (especially a woman) you cannot enjoy *full* sexual experiences when you are circumsized!My husband was circumsized as a baby and he enjoys the *full* sexual experience!My brother in law was NOT circumsized and he also enjoys *full* sexual experience with my sister in law!It is the ONLY sexual experience they know so why wouldn't it be the *full* sexual experience.I believe that every man circumsized or not enjoys the *full* sexual experience!I have a newborn son who I did NOT circumsize because I could not bare to put him through the pain,to look like his father,knowing full well there are no medical reasons to do as such, bare in mind I had full intentions on getting him circumsized until I actually seen how small it was and figured who am I to decide.I think as mothers we decide what we feel is best for our children and if one feels that circumcision is best for her son then so be it,who are we to knock her down for her decision!Here in Canada we have health coverage that one day use to pay for circumcision in newborns and now with all the medical evidence they DO NOT! Needless to say there are fewer circumsized boys for that reason, it makes you actually educate yourself on the issue.
Circumcision: cut to the truth
Posted by: lallia
Posted on: 2003-04-10 22:38:33
My husband watched the circumcision part of the show and commented, "Angie, you are overthinking this WAY too much!" He is circumcised himself and laughs to scorn the idea that it has impacted his sexuality in any way, (or for that matter affected his feelings toward his mother!) He said, "I'd hate to be any more sexual than I am! A man has only so much time!" and I have to agree, as his happy but tired wife!;)
Posted by: lallia
Posted on: 2003-04-10 22:38:33
My husband watched the circumcision part of the show and commented, "Angie, you are overthinking this WAY too much!" He is circumcised himself and laughs to scorn the idea that it has impacted his sexuality in any way, (or for that matter affected his feelings toward his mother!) He said, "I'd hate to be any more sexual than I am! A man has only so much time!" and I have to agree, as his happy but tired wife!;)
Circumcision reality
Posted by: sicsociety
Posted on: 2003-04-12 17:12:38
A male that has been circumcised does not know what he has lost. How can he? Besides...the male ego will not accept that he has been damaged.
I am not against an adult undergoing a circumcision...BUT no one has the right to force this unncessary medical procedure on a helpless child.
Facts you don't know or want to accept.
(which can be found at our website StopInfantCircumcision.org )
85% of the men in the world are intact(uncut)
The foreskin is NOT a birthdefect.
When you remove the foreskin...you also remove the Ridged Band of Sexual Nerves. These nerves are the most highly sensitive nerves in the male body. Thus the reason for the following.....
Circumcision was adopted in America in the 1860's as a misguided way to curb masturbation. GO READ. All of our medical history supports this claim.
The ACS American Cancer Society does not support circumcision as a preventative message against penile cancer. Penile cancer is actually a very rare occurance.
The AAP American Academy of Pediatrics stated in 1971 that "there are no valid indications for circumcision in the neonatal period.
The AMA American Medical Association no longer supports or recommends infant circumcision.
Medical organizations around the world have stated that they no longer support routine infant circumcision.
PRINCESS DIANA.....DID NOT CIRCUMCISE HER SONS. ELVIS wasnt circumcised. President Gerald Ford. The list goes on and on.
Circumcision is an outdated unnecessary procedur
Posted by: sicsociety
Posted on: 2003-04-12 17:12:38
A male that has been circumcised does not know what he has lost. How can he? Besides...the male ego will not accept that he has been damaged.
I am not against an adult undergoing a circumcision...BUT no one has the right to force this unncessary medical procedure on a helpless child.
Facts you don't know or want to accept.
(which can be found at our website StopInfantCircumcision.org )
85% of the men in the world are intact(uncut)
The foreskin is NOT a birthdefect.
When you remove the foreskin...you also remove the Ridged Band of Sexual Nerves. These nerves are the most highly sensitive nerves in the male body. Thus the reason for the following.....
Circumcision was adopted in America in the 1860's as a misguided way to curb masturbation. GO READ. All of our medical history supports this claim.
The ACS American Cancer Society does not support circumcision as a preventative message against penile cancer. Penile cancer is actually a very rare occurance.
The AAP American Academy of Pediatrics stated in 1971 that "there are no valid indications for circumcision in the neonatal period.
The AMA American Medical Association no longer supports or recommends infant circumcision.
Medical organizations around the world have stated that they no longer support routine infant circumcision.
PRINCESS DIANA.....DID NOT CIRCUMCISE HER SONS. ELVIS wasnt circumcised. President Gerald Ford. The list goes on and on.
Circumcision is an outdated unnecessary procedur
Posted by: kossenw
Posted on: 2003-05-08 19:45:46
I have heard similar comments before. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a sexometer! Short of having one, we know that cutting of one’s fingertips will compromise one’s ability to play piano or read brail and cutting of the tip of one’s tongue leads to a speech impediment. Even if this is done during the first few days of life, speech and piano playing is still compromised, regardless of whether that is all the child knows. What would make anyone think that cutting of the penile skin that is normally used in intercourse and making the skin of the glans penis undergo metaplasia does not compromise the sexual experience? Why is it that those interested in women’s issues pushed for a ban on female circumcision, including the exact equivalent of male circumcision, i.e. removal of the clitoral foreskin?
Religious circumcision was abandoned by early Christians. This was clearly not done for religious reasons but for reasons of making Christianity acceptable to gentiles. At least the men among the gentiles knew full well what the foreskin was doing for them and what they were to loose through circumcision. They may have been ignorant back in those days, but clearly not stupid.
There is perhaps one other way one can look at this issue. Recently, someone showed me some data on divorce and spousal cheating. The data showed that we in the US have the highest divorce rate and men cheating on their wives in the western world. Could this in any way be related to the fact that be
Re: Wake up, Sandy
Posted by: em1234
Posted on: 2003-04-11 16:39:06
[Quote: "There *are* reasons to be circumsized."]
Yes, the reasons are numerous:
www.circumstitions.com/Stitions&refs.html
Thankfully, there are BETTER reasons NOT to do it:
www.circumstitions.com/ReasonsNotto.html
[Quote: "For one, wives of uncircumsized men have a much higher rate of cervical cancer."]
A myth:
www.circumstitions.com/Cancer.html#cervical
www.fathermag.com/health/circ/cerv-cancer/
www.cirp.org/library/disease/cancer/
[Quote: "For another, my uncle had penial cancer at 78 because he couldn't deal properly with his hygiene and was not circumsised."]
So, a case of RARE penile cancer warrants the mutilation of ALL baby boys?
Betcha didn't know women get genital cancer about 2x as often than intact men. And betcha didn't know the circ scar is a common point of entry for penile cancer.
Also, the incidence of penile cancer is about 1/100,000 (RARE!). Compare that with the 1/8 for female breast cancer. Now, wouldn't the women in this world benefit GREATLY by having their breast tissue removed at birth if it meant a near-0 risk of getting breast cancer?
[Quote: "I know two adult men who had to have the surgery for that reason also. So it must be a problem."]
Given the incidence of this type of cancer, I find this EXTREMELY unlikely. You're not a circlist troll, are you?
[Quote: "My kids suffered through many bouts of strep because tonsillectomies were not in vogue..."]
Sandy, you REALLY need to keep up with the times.
Posted by: em1234
Posted on: 2003-04-11 16:39:06
[Quote: "There *are* reasons to be circumsized."]
Yes, the reasons are numerous:
www.circumstitions.com/Stitions&refs.html
Thankfully, there are BETTER reasons NOT to do it:
www.circumstitions.com/ReasonsNotto.html
[Quote: "For one, wives of uncircumsized men have a much higher rate of cervical cancer."]
A myth:
www.circumstitions.com/Cancer.html#cervical
www.fathermag.com/health/circ/cerv-cancer/
www.cirp.org/library/disease/cancer/
[Quote: "For another, my uncle had penial cancer at 78 because he couldn't deal properly with his hygiene and was not circumsised."]
So, a case of RARE penile cancer warrants the mutilation of ALL baby boys?
Betcha didn't know women get genital cancer about 2x as often than intact men. And betcha didn't know the circ scar is a common point of entry for penile cancer.
Also, the incidence of penile cancer is about 1/100,000 (RARE!). Compare that with the 1/8 for female breast cancer. Now, wouldn't the women in this world benefit GREATLY by having their breast tissue removed at birth if it meant a near-0 risk of getting breast cancer?
[Quote: "I know two adult men who had to have the surgery for that reason also. So it must be a problem."]
Given the incidence of this type of cancer, I find this EXTREMELY unlikely. You're not a circlist troll, are you?
[Quote: "My kids suffered through many bouts of strep because tonsillectomies were not in vogue..."]
Sandy, you REALLY need to keep up with the times.
Just Say No!
Posted by: big_dave
Posted on: 2003-04-16 15:03:37
I had it done to me. I still love my parents. I hate the fact that I was mutilated superfluously. Some truths from my experience:
1. I felt ashamed that my penis was different than my father's, brother's or 90% of my peers.
2. I had persistent nightmares throughout childhood and early adulthood. I remember the fear, screaming, confinement, and pain. The bright light in my eyes, the doctor, and an strange shiny instrument that I always looked out for to see if it was real. Years later I identified it as the circumsion clamp.
3. The feeling of not being whole, especially for no legitimate reason whatsoever makes one feel sickened. To never know what normal penile sensations feel like, since the unprotected head is partially desensitized by constant friction.
Dave
Posted by: big_dave
Posted on: 2003-04-16 15:03:37
I had it done to me. I still love my parents. I hate the fact that I was mutilated superfluously. Some truths from my experience:
1. I felt ashamed that my penis was different than my father's, brother's or 90% of my peers.
2. I had persistent nightmares throughout childhood and early adulthood. I remember the fear, screaming, confinement, and pain. The bright light in my eyes, the doctor, and an strange shiny instrument that I always looked out for to see if it was real. Years later I identified it as the circumsion clamp.
3. The feeling of not being whole, especially for no legitimate reason whatsoever makes one feel sickened. To never know what normal penile sensations feel like, since the unprotected head is partially desensitized by constant friction.
Dave
get a grip
Posted by: sjlman
Posted on: 2003-09-12 16:14:44
This procedure is painful, but currently, doctors offer pain killers to the baby such as Tylenol that helps them through it. The doctor told me my son would be better off having it done now, than face infection/issues later. Good luck to anyone making this decision.
Posted by: sjlman
Posted on: 2003-09-12 16:14:44
This procedure is painful, but currently, doctors offer pain killers to the baby such as Tylenol that helps them through it. The doctor told me my son would be better off having it done now, than face infection/issues later. Good luck to anyone making this decision.
my husband is not circumcised...
Posted by: katcrz
Posted on: 2003-09-25 23:55:58
I did have my two boys circumcised, but if I had it to do all over again, I would not do it. The reason being that I found out first had the difference that not having this done can make. My husband from my 2nd marriage is not circumcised and the pleasure sex is so incrediably different because of the enhanced pleasure that he has because of this., that is one thing that my mother-in-law did do right!
Posted by: katcrz
Posted on: 2003-09-25 23:55:58
I did have my two boys circumcised, but if I had it to do all over again, I would not do it. The reason being that I found out first had the difference that not having this done can make. My husband from my 2nd marriage is not circumcised and the pleasure sex is so incrediably different because of the enhanced pleasure that he has because of this., that is one thing that my mother-in-law did do right!
DO YOU?!?!!?
Posted by: seapoe
Posted on: 2003-04-08 23:46:26
I don't know what your problem is to make a scared mother more worried about what she DID NOT DO WRONG! I DO HAVE a son that I had circumcised when he was 3-days-old and he's a healthy, happy, normal boy. I'm glad I did it, it was for religious and hygeine reasons, and I recommend all mothers to do it. My son is now 5 years-old and if he ever asks me why I did it, I would tell him because I want you to be healthy and clean and having a flab of skin that is infested with crusty urine is not clean or healthy. I really don't give a damb what any doctor would say, and I don't think you have a right either.
Posted by: seapoe
Posted on: 2003-04-08 23:46:26
I don't know what your problem is to make a scared mother more worried about what she DID NOT DO WRONG! I DO HAVE a son that I had circumcised when he was 3-days-old and he's a healthy, happy, normal boy. I'm glad I did it, it was for religious and hygeine reasons, and I recommend all mothers to do it. My son is now 5 years-old and if he ever asks me why I did it, I would tell him because I want you to be healthy and clean and having a flab of skin that is infested with crusty urine is not clean or healthy. I really don't give a damb what any doctor would say, and I don't think you have a right either.
Seapoe get a clue
Posted by: fourplease
Posted on: 2003-04-10 10:51:50
I have 2 sons who are intact...they are as they were created. To say that your son doesn't have a "flab of skin infested with crusty urine is not clean or healthy" is about one of most ridiculous things I've ever heard. First it's not a flab of skin...the foreskin is actually a glad which serves a function. The foreskin does not get "infested with crusty urine" and to think it does really tells me a lot about your thinking. The penis of my boys are very clean and not the least bit crusty...if you have seen a man with a crusty penis from urine it was NOT because his forsking wasn't amuptated it is because he either has a medical issue or is just a slob.
And I certainly hope nobody takes the recommendation of a woman who appears to have no clue.
Posted by: fourplease
Posted on: 2003-04-10 10:51:50
I have 2 sons who are intact...they are as they were created. To say that your son doesn't have a "flab of skin infested with crusty urine is not clean or healthy" is about one of most ridiculous things I've ever heard. First it's not a flab of skin...the foreskin is actually a glad which serves a function. The foreskin does not get "infested with crusty urine" and to think it does really tells me a lot about your thinking. The penis of my boys are very clean and not the least bit crusty...if you have seen a man with a crusty penis from urine it was NOT because his forsking wasn't amuptated it is because he either has a medical issue or is just a slob.
And I certainly hope nobody takes the recommendation of a woman who appears to have no clue.
NO! DO YOU??
Posted by: taygav
Posted on: 2003-04-10 12:52:25
I cannot believe I read your response to say that an uncircumsized boy will have a flab of skin that is infested with crusty urine! Bathe your child and he will remain clean cirmcisized or not, you need to educate yourself on the subject before attacking another mother. When you say you did it for religious reasons like the other mother said your religion or his! Again another decision as a mother we make for our children and who are we to judge you for your decision and I may not agree with your religion and you may not mine but that is what makes these countries so great, WE CAN MAKE THESE TYPES OF DECISIONS!!!
Posted by: taygav
Posted on: 2003-04-10 12:52:25
I cannot believe I read your response to say that an uncircumsized boy will have a flab of skin that is infested with crusty urine! Bathe your child and he will remain clean cirmcisized or not, you need to educate yourself on the subject before attacking another mother. When you say you did it for religious reasons like the other mother said your religion or his! Again another decision as a mother we make for our children and who are we to judge you for your decision and I may not agree with your religion and you may not mine but that is what makes these countries so great, WE CAN MAKE THESE TYPES OF DECISIONS!!!
offended
Posted by: wysmom
Posted on: 2003-04-10 13:27:39
I'm so offended that you think a boy with foreskin is dirty or less healthy than your son. My husband is not circumsized and I've never seen anything encrusted on his foreskin. You are wrong to think that circumsized boys are cleaner or healthier. There is a reason that the foreskin does not fully retract in infant boys. It helps protect them from irritants that can cause harm. You say you circumsize for religious reasons, but for a woman who believes in God you certainly question God's ability to design the male penis. If the foreskin is so unclean and unhealthy why did God put it there?
Posted by: wysmom
Posted on: 2003-04-10 13:27:39
I'm so offended that you think a boy with foreskin is dirty or less healthy than your son. My husband is not circumsized and I've never seen anything encrusted on his foreskin. You are wrong to think that circumsized boys are cleaner or healthier. There is a reason that the foreskin does not fully retract in infant boys. It helps protect them from irritants that can cause harm. You say you circumsize for religious reasons, but for a woman who believes in God you certainly question God's ability to design the male penis. If the foreskin is so unclean and unhealthy why did God put it there?
